Navigating Towards the Future of Podcast Editing with Bethany Hawkins

Carrie: 00:00:04

So how much is that?

Carrie: 00:00:13

So

Carrie: 00:00:16

you

Carrie: 00:00:18

and welcome to the podcast editors of Master Mind, this

Carrie: 00:00:22

show about the business of podcast editing. I'm your host

Carrie: 00:00:27

tonight, Cory Coffield. Eric. You can learn more about me at

Carrie: 00:00:31

Kari Dot Land, L, A and D. I'm joined by Ryan and Slinger of

Carrie: 00:00:38

top tier audio and not able to join us tonight. Daniel

Carrie: 00:00:43

Abendroth from Roth Media and Jennifer Longworth of Bourbon

Carrie: 00:00:50

Barrel podcast. We are excited to welcome tonight Bethany

Carrie: 00:00:55

Hawkins, founder of the podcast service agency Crackers in Soup.

Carrie: 00:01:02

You can find her at Crackers in Soup dot com. She also has a

Carrie: 00:01:07

wonderful podcast called Chatting over Chowder, which you

Carrie: 00:01:12

should definitely check out.

Bethany: 00:01:14

Thank you for having me. And you know, it's it's hella

Bethany: 00:01:17

late. It's 9 p.m. I've usually been in bed for a good hour

Bethany: 00:01:21

because I'm super old. So however you want to see my name.

Carrie: 00:01:26

It's, you know, I'm tripping over because it's 9:00

Carrie: 00:01:30

and just say, God.

Bethany: 00:01:33

I literally had to take a nap to appear at this meeting

Bethany: 00:01:36

because I'm in that stage of my life.

Bryan: 00:01:38

I know Steve said something about a drinking game,

Bryan: 00:01:40

but I think it's a little bit early for us to start that. So

Bryan: 00:01:43

not.

Bethany: 00:01:43

Yet. Can our drinking game be coffee?

Bryan: 00:01:46

Yeah, totally.

Carrie: 00:01:46

You know, we'll pick a day and have a drunk podcast at

Carrie: 00:01:49

any discussion that you might mind.

Bethany: 00:01:53

That could be fire. Fire.

Carrie: 00:01:56

So we are talking about the future of the podcast

Carrie: 00:02:00

editing in history. Lots of things have been happening and

Carrie: 00:02:04

the podcast landscape is shifting. Podcasting is becoming

Carrie: 00:02:09

more mainstream and I just thought it was a good time to

Carrie: 00:02:14

like take a minute and be like, Hey, what do you see? What's

Carrie: 00:02:17

going on? What do you think? And kind of open up the conversation.

Carrie: 00:02:22

And Steve says, We can't play the drinking game because we

Carrie: 00:02:25

should not influence the outcome. So yeah, this show would be like

Carrie: 00:02:31

in Coherent if I were drinking. Steve didn't take much, but we

Carrie: 00:02:37

wanted to talk about what is going on in our industry

Carrie: 00:02:43

particularly. We don't have a ton of these conversations like

Carrie: 00:02:48

out loud in public. I mean, we do like privately and we have

Carrie: 00:02:52

our little things, but so I thought it would be great to

Carrie: 00:02:56

start a conversation with you all. And one of the reasons I

Carrie: 00:03:00

have Bethenny on here is because she is so insightful and she

Carrie: 00:03:04

like she straps podcast editing wisdom bombs that. So I just

Carrie: 00:03:09

knew I had to have her on for this topic. And thank you,

Carrie: 00:03:11

Bethenny, for saying yes. But before we begin, can you tell us

Carrie: 00:03:16

a little bit about what you do specifically, Bethenny?

Bethany: 00:03:20

Sure. Firstly, let me say hello, Steve. Hello, Sandra.

Bethany: 00:03:23

Steve, you in the past? Me, I do what I want. Let the drinking

Bethany: 00:03:26

games commence.

Bethany: 00:03:29

Secondly, I am Anthony Hawkins. I am the CEO and founder of

Bethany: 00:03:33

Crackers in Soup. Crackers and Soup is a podcast production and

Bethany: 00:03:37

coaching company. And we have worked on over 80 podcasts. We

Bethany: 00:03:42

are winning an award nominated production company, which is

Bethany: 00:03:46

just wild to me. Our business started in 2019 and since then

Bethany: 00:03:51

we have hit the ground running. It is really interesting to see

Bethany: 00:03:56

the changes of the podcasting industry in that short amount of

Bethany: 00:04:01

time. I feel like if you started in podcasting in any aspect, in

Bethany: 00:04:05

podcasting, whether it was production or management or copy

Bethany: 00:04:09

or just creating a podcast before COVID, it's like you're a

Bethany: 00:04:14

dinosaur, a

Bethany: 00:04:19

But it's because there have been so many changes since COVID

Bethany: 00:04:24

happened. It's wild. The courses that I took and the information

Bethany: 00:04:28

that I learned in early 2019 to create this business. A lot of

Bethany: 00:04:34

it has become obsolete now because of A.I., because of the

Bethany: 00:04:38

technological advances. And I just think that it is so

Bethany: 00:04:42

interesting to watch the progression as somebody who

Bethany: 00:04:45

started before, like the AI explosion and podcasting.

Carrie: 00:04:48

So I wanted to ask you all, what specifically have you

Carrie: 00:04:54

seen recently as kind of an emerging trend? How about you,

Carrie: 00:05:01

Bethany?

Bethany: 00:05:02

So with the explosion of YouTube creating podcasts.

Bryan: 00:05:07

Wait, did you just say YouTube, creating podcasts.

Bethany: 00:05:10

YouTube, creating podcasts?

Bryan: 00:05:12

I'm sorry, that's fake news.

Bethany: 00:05:16

Now that YouTube is saying we're a podcast hosting

Bethany: 00:05:19

station, I see a lot of what I consider soft editing. And if

Bethany: 00:05:24

people are going to be using the audio from editing, they're now

Bethany: 00:05:27

at a point where they are not taking the time to do all of the

Bethany: 00:05:32

audio enhancements that your listener really deserves. So

Bethany: 00:05:37

taking out those long pauses, taking out the incessant filler

Bethany: 00:05:43

words, normalizing the audio so that you're not blasting their

Bethany: 00:05:47

ears out, or even the little things that Steve actually often

Bethany: 00:05:52

talks about, like making sure that your microphone is working,

Bethany: 00:05:54

making sure that you have plug in headphones. They're not

Bethany: 00:05:57

taking the time and opportunity to do things like that. They're

Bethany: 00:05:59

just making sure that they're surrounding as pretty because

Bethany: 00:06:02

it's going to be loaded up on on video and then they're not

Bethany: 00:06:06

understanding why they're not getting the downloads from the

Bethany: 00:06:08

audio because you're not doing your due diligence when it comes

Bethany: 00:06:11

to the audio. So I like to consider it soft editing. I'm

Bethany: 00:06:16

not going to use the word,

Bethany: 00:06:20

but I feel like it's a disservice if you are going to

Bethany: 00:06:23

be calling yourself a podcaster and not clean up the audio when

Bethany: 00:06:30

you're uploading it and it's going through the distribution

Bethany: 00:06:33

like Apple and Spotify and such. So that's a trend that I'm

Bethany: 00:06:37

seeing and it may give me hives, I'm just saying.

Carrie: 00:06:41

So there's a disconnect for me here that I don't just

Carrie: 00:06:44

understand why people do this, because there's still audio on

Carrie: 00:06:48

video. So I'm not just like looking at you. I don't just

Carrie: 00:06:52

want to stare at you watching, you know, for the entire

Carrie: 00:06:57

experience. So why do you think that they don't consider that at

Carrie: 00:07:01

all? Like, what am I missing that make people not care?

Bethany: 00:07:05

I think what's happening now is everything is

Bethany: 00:07:08

short stints of information, so they want it quick and they want

Bethany: 00:07:13

a visual, but they want to call it a podcast. So when I started,

Bethany: 00:07:18

I was taught if it's done on RSS feed and uploaded into a podcast

Bethany: 00:07:23

hosting station, it is not a podcast and I'm probably going

Bethany: 00:07:26

to die on that hill. And I like that the video is coming out. I

Bethany: 00:07:30

think that that helps with engagement because you really

Bethany: 00:07:33

get an opportunity to see the people's facial expression and

Bethany: 00:07:36

it gives it a little bit more nuance than just listening to

Bethany: 00:07:40

the audio. But if I am listening to a podcast, I am listening to

Bethany: 00:07:43

it as an audio. So please make your audio good. If not great, I.

Carrie: 00:07:49

Will take comfortable.

Bethany: 00:07:52

I get moved all around. So if there's somebody who's

Bethany: 00:07:54

consistently having noises in the background like a dog

Bethany: 00:07:57

barking or like like a garbage truck happening and that's not

Bethany: 00:08:01

taken out, I'm immediately distracted by that. And I've

Bethany: 00:08:06

missed a good 5 minutes of what you were talking about.

Bryan: 00:08:08

This is just my perspective. I think there's

Bryan: 00:08:10

really two things going on. One, I think we've gotten the

Bryan: 00:08:13

consistent message that audiences don't care. And so if

Bryan: 00:08:17

you come from the world of lean manufacturing or value based

Bryan: 00:08:20

pricing or something like that, a thing that you do that

Bryan: 00:08:23

somebody won't pay for is waste. So why would I waste my time if

Bryan: 00:08:28

my audience, as somebody told me, doesn't care? And I think

Bryan: 00:08:33

there's alongside that, there's maybe a little bit of a lack of

Bryan: 00:08:36

pride that says, well, if it's good enough for my audience,

Bryan: 00:08:38

then I shouldn't care. It doesn't represent me. But in my

Bryan: 00:08:42

view, and I could be wrong, the best channels on YouTube are

Bryan: 00:08:47

edited, the most popular channels on YouTube, even if

Bryan: 00:08:50

they're blathering, idiots are edited and they are strategic

Bryan: 00:08:54

and they are done well. The best podcasts are done well. If we

Bryan: 00:08:57

want to live in a world where Wayne's World, where two guys

Bryan: 00:09:01

living in a basement make a stupid show with really low

Bryan: 00:09:04

production quality, we're going to look back five years from now

Bryan: 00:09:07

and say, Oh, it's just the big money that came into podcasting

Bryan: 00:09:10

that ruined everything. No, it's that you didn't care enough

Bryan: 00:09:13

about your craft to defend your ability to do something. Well,

Bryan: 00:09:16

this isn't about defending my turf. This is about saying I

Bryan: 00:09:19

care enough to make something that I'm proud of, that the

Bryan: 00:09:23

people that listen to will enjoy and be pleased by. And I care

Bryan: 00:09:28

enough to take out all the garbage before I invite people

Bryan: 00:09:31

into my house and ask them to sit down for an.

Carrie: 00:09:33

Hour with me. Yeah, I love that. I think that's a good

Carrie: 00:09:36

point. Now I'm just thinking about the irony is I'm sitting

Carrie: 00:09:38

here like I forgot to turn the air conditioner off and my dad

Carrie: 00:09:41

is calling on the intercom, so.

Bryan: 00:09:43

But that won't be in the final.

Carrie: 00:09:45

I don't know that Alejandro is good, though, so.

Carrie: 00:09:50

No, but, you know, I have noticed. Okay, so I'm not going

Carrie: 00:09:55

to lie. I love it. And I love it for two reasons. I love it

Carrie: 00:09:58

because there are some really brilliant content creators on

Carrie: 00:10:02

there and great interesting content, but also because you

Carrie: 00:10:08

can see the rise of somebody who does take the time to create

Carrie: 00:10:15

good content. You can literally like watch them grow day by day,

Carrie: 00:10:20

and it is just the most kind of amazing thing. And I just been

Carrie: 00:10:26

dissecting kind of what what are they're doing that's working and

Carrie: 00:10:29

one of what's not working. Like, why are some like getting stuck

Carrie: 00:10:33

and why are others taking off? And I and I really think it it

Carrie: 00:10:36

comes down to kind of the quality, the consistency and the

Carrie: 00:10:40

content, right? I don't feel like that's really heavily

Carrie: 00:10:44

taught consistency, you know, maybe content, but like quality

Carrie: 00:10:49

is, is the really hard part. I think. Jesse McEwen says the

Carrie: 00:10:55

longer the content is, the more important quality becomes.

Carrie: 00:10:58

Absolutely. People can tolerate poor audio for a couple of

Carrie: 00:11:02

minutes on a real but not much. About 30 minute piece of content.

Carrie: 00:11:06

Yeah, unless you are exceptional like a phenomena. Is there

Carrie: 00:11:12

anything we can do about like is it ever going to change or are

Carrie: 00:11:14

we going to have to adapt to it? Because, you know, the reality

Carrie: 00:11:18

is people's perception is people's perception. A lot of

Carrie: 00:11:22

the market isn't interested in quality like, you know, what do

Carrie: 00:11:26

you do about that?

Bryan: 00:11:28

The market won't endure forever, right? The market will

Bryan: 00:11:31

not abide this forever, because the ones that do care will rise

Bryan: 00:11:36

to the top and the ones that don't will say, well, podcasting

Bryan: 00:11:38

doesn't work and they'll get mad and they'll throw down their

Bryan: 00:11:40

ball and bat and go home.

Carrie: 00:11:41

But the crazy thing is, if you're good, if you're good

Carrie: 00:11:44

at podcasting, you make the money. I mean, to spear you like,

Carrie: 00:11:49

you can monetize yourself.

Bethany: 00:11:51

But I think that this is when it's really important

Bethany: 00:11:53

for people who are creating courses or people who are

Bethany: 00:11:56

teaching either podcast management or production or

Bethany: 00:12:00

audio engineering to emphasize the importance of having great

Bethany: 00:12:05

audio. So even if you are not editing the video, you are doing

Bethany: 00:12:10

all of the things to set yourself up for success. When

Bethany: 00:12:13

you extract that audio from that video and also being able to

Bethany: 00:12:18

explain it to your potential client or your potential

Bethany: 00:12:22

audience, why you are taking the time to work and admire and not

Bethany: 00:12:28

just throw it into some API and cross your fingers and hope that

Bethany: 00:12:33

they do all of the things that it usually would take you hours

Bethany: 00:12:37

to do. So I think the onus is put on the people in the

Bethany: 00:12:41

industry that are paying their mortgage with creating this

Bethany: 00:12:46

content on behalf of the people that are retaining them.

Bryan: 00:12:49

Part of me also says, you know, there's in the past

Bryan: 00:12:52

there's been a culture of gatekeeping, not so much within

Bryan: 00:12:55

podcasting, but in other media, right? And so for a long time,

Bryan: 00:12:58

the message of podcasting was just get started, figure it out

Bryan: 00:13:02

on the way and keep getting better. The problem is we've

Bryan: 00:13:05

forgotten about the continuous improvement part as a broader

Bryan: 00:13:09

community is speaking in broad strokes, right?

Carrie: 00:13:12

What did podcasting ever consider what its adulthood

Carrie: 00:13:15

would look like?

Bethany: 00:13:16

Probably not, because it's only 20 years old right now.

Bethany: 00:13:19

It can't even so podcasting can't even rent a car right?

Bethany: 00:13:24

Can do car. So Emmy isn't a dolt, but is it really an adult? I

Bethany: 00:13:29

remember when I was 20.

Carrie: 00:13:30

Yeah. I wouldn't trust me with anything.

Bethany: 00:13:33

I can't believe I was allowed to vote on this.

Bryan: 00:13:37

And the beautiful thing about podcasting is that you

Bryan: 00:13:39

don't have to be old enough to vote to have one, right? In fact,

Bryan: 00:13:44

if you can get a parent to sign off for you, you don't even have

Bryan: 00:13:46

to be 13 to have one, unlike getting a YouTube channel or

Bryan: 00:13:49

something like that. I mean, of course there are terms of

Bryan: 00:13:51

service and stuff, but it is the place where you can do

Bryan: 00:13:56

essentially whatever you want, so long as it's legal, right?

Bryan: 00:13:59

You don't get shut down for that reason. But that doesn't mean

Bryan: 00:14:01

you should and it doesn't mean that you shouldn't continue to

Bryan: 00:14:04

try to improve. I know of a couple of shows that are quite

Bryan: 00:14:07

unedited and one of one or two of them are pretty popular. The

Bryan: 00:14:10

thing is, the people that are hosting those shows have been

Bryan: 00:14:13

doing it since before podcasting was a thing. And they're good.

Bryan: 00:14:17

They were good before they started and they've only gotten

Bryan: 00:14:19

better and they've built their entire process to take them live,

Bryan: 00:14:22

to drive so that all they have to do is export the file. I'm

Bryan: 00:14:26

not that good. Me not edited as well. This. Yeah.

Carrie: 00:14:30

It is a train wreck. Yeah.

Bethany: 00:14:32

So but I think that that also goes back to learning

Bethany: 00:14:37

to listen to your content and learning to listen to what you

Bethany: 00:14:41

put out and learning from that experience of listening. As a

Bethany: 00:14:45

person who hasn't heard this content before and saying, Oh,

Bethany: 00:14:49

this is where I can make changes, This was super dope, I love this.

Bethany: 00:14:52

Let's keep that in. When I talk to my clients, I let them know

Bethany: 00:14:55

the first season is usually 12 episodes. We usually do the

Bethany: 00:14:59

first season of the 12 episodes. That season is for learning like

Bethany: 00:15:02

we're not going back and listening to your episodes as

Bethany: 00:15:05

soon as they're published. Not only are you helping you

Bethany: 00:15:08

download numbers, but but you should be taking just mental

Bethany: 00:15:12

note. I say like too much. I pause significantly. I'm not

Bethany: 00:15:17

taking an opportunity to think about what I'm going to say

Bethany: 00:15:20

before I verbalize it. Those little nuances are going to help

Bethany: 00:15:25

you in the long editing process. If eventually you want to take

Bethany: 00:15:29

control of your podcast and do everything yourself.

Carrie: 00:15:32

And I would argue that a lot of us, before we started

Carrie: 00:15:36

editing for other people, we were listening to our content,

Carrie: 00:15:40

we were critiquing ourselves. We were like, Oh my God, it's and

Carrie: 00:15:43

again, and I'm going to work on that. Like you made that

Carrie: 00:15:46

commitment because you were like, If I can shave an hour off of

Carrie: 00:15:49

editing, I'll be thrilled. And that's the exact thing that we

Carrie: 00:15:54

are wanting to relieve our clients from that laborious

Carrie: 00:15:58

editing part. They don't like that. They obviously aren't

Carrie: 00:16:01

doing so. Does that mean that maybe the customers will not

Carrie: 00:16:09

want editors quite as much because they're not for the

Carrie: 00:16:13

podcasters and aren't going to need editors quite as much

Carrie: 00:16:16

because they're just throwing it on YouTube. And then if they do

Carrie: 00:16:20

have an editor, then are they going to want a video editor,

Carrie: 00:16:23

for instance? Like should we all be learning like DaVinci Resolve

Carrie: 00:16:28

or Adobe Premiere? I mean, what is you know, because those two

Carrie: 00:16:33

things like audio is not going away, but neither is video. And

Carrie: 00:16:37

if a person can or if a content creator or anybody can just make

Carrie: 00:16:41

them all together and like just repair, you know, divide up the,

Carrie: 00:16:46

you know, whatever, distribute it, do we need to learn those

Carrie: 00:16:49

skills?

Bethany: 00:16:50

I do not offer video services because I'm not good at

Bethany: 00:16:54

it and I'm not going to have somebody pay me for something

Bethany: 00:16:59

that I am not good at. Like, don't waste your money on me and

Bethany: 00:17:03

I don't want to edit video.

Carrie: 00:17:06

I don't either.

Bethany: 00:17:07

I have no desire and I think knowing who you are and

Bethany: 00:17:11

what you want and what services you want to provide, where is

Bethany: 00:17:14

your zone of genius? Where do you want to learn to be better?

Bethany: 00:17:19

I think those are the services that you that you should offer.

Bethany: 00:17:23

I think that people get very caught up in that. What is the

Bethany: 00:17:27

quickest way to make a buck now instead of saying Where am I

Bethany: 00:17:33

going to take the time and energy to invest in my craft so

Bethany: 00:17:39

that I can make my craft better, even if it's not the end thing?

Bethany: 00:17:42

Now? Because everything has a season and everything circles

Bethany: 00:17:45

back. So all of these people that are abandoning audio

Bethany: 00:17:48

editing to do video editing only what happens when the video

Bethany: 00:17:54

party ends where all of those audio people are going to be

Bethany: 00:17:58

they're going to switch back. I just have the time nor the

Bethany: 00:18:02

energy to want to offer that as a service. And there are people

Bethany: 00:18:06

that do. And I'm like, Go queens, I'll refer you to that.

Carrie: 00:18:10

Right. And I'm ready to start building a list.

Bethany: 00:18:12

Though, like, let me give you my affiliate link. Yeah,

Bethany: 00:18:18

and enjoy them. But I think that you really have to tap into you

Bethany: 00:18:22

and what you're just one of geniuses and what you want to be

Bethany: 00:18:25

in this podcasting.

Carrie: 00:18:26

World does this as hog and and as businesses and other

Carrie: 00:18:34

media, like traditional media, starts to really realize the

Carrie: 00:18:39

value of not only the audio, but, you know, the long and short

Carrie: 00:18:43

form video. They are one team to come in and do what they do and

Carrie: 00:18:49

like put their money in, dominate the space, and use it

Carrie: 00:18:52

to make oodles and loads of money for themselves. You know,

Carrie: 00:18:56

on the flip side, there will be more kind of corporate network

Carrie: 00:19:01

production, house jobs opening up and and this kind of leads in

Carrie: 00:19:05

to that trend I was noticing, which was Hollywood companies

Carrie: 00:19:11

wanting to find parts, service providers. I've talked to a

Carrie: 00:19:17

couple people from a couple different companies in the past

Carrie: 00:19:21

couple of weeks. You know, they're like, Oh, we're looking

Carrie: 00:19:24

into this company. I'm like, I know that person and we're

Carrie: 00:19:27

looking into that company. I'm like, Oh, okay, they're great,

Carrie: 00:19:30

you know, kind of thing. And it's these larger it's it's

Carrie: 00:19:33

editing companies that do volume right at a lower rate, but

Carrie: 00:19:37

they're starting to offer more expanded services like the

Carrie: 00:19:41

dialogue editing, like the sound design, even, you know, writing,

Carrie: 00:19:47

right, putting together the content and being the ghost

Carrie: 00:19:51

producer. So I think that it's maybe like, I don't know what

Carrie: 00:19:58

that's going to be, but what I hear from Head to productions

Carrie: 00:20:03

and studio people is that the film and TV people do not want

Carrie: 00:20:09

to touch podcasting like the way they do editing and production

Carrie: 00:20:15

in TV and film from, you know, everything I've been told is

Carrie: 00:20:21

that you do it with the like executive producer or the writer,

Carrie: 00:20:25

you know, whoever is in charge of the story of that show, you

Carrie: 00:20:29

sit down with them and you do the actual editing, right? You

Carrie: 00:20:32

decide what to cut. And then when you do the sound design,

Carrie: 00:20:36

you sit down with them. You sit down with whoever is in charge

Carrie: 00:20:40

of making the content for the show and making those creative

Carrie: 00:20:44

decisions. And you do it together. And what Hollywood is

Carrie: 00:20:49

starting to discover is it can work when you are not in the

Carrie: 00:20:55

same room. And I think this is going to start to open up more

Carrie: 00:20:58

opportunities for people like us that come from the indie space,

Carrie: 00:21:04

largely because I don't know how many times. I mean, I started

Carrie: 00:21:08

teaching dialogue editing because I couldn't referring

Carrie: 00:21:11

buddy to do it because I didn't know how to do it. So I think

Carrie: 00:21:14

these jobs are going to start to open up more and more. And I

Carrie: 00:21:16

think I think what's going to end up happening in terms of

Carrie: 00:21:20

post-production production in general is I think that the way

Carrie: 00:21:25

we have done things is now going to filter out into other

Carrie: 00:21:29

industries and there is going to be a lot of merging in the

Carrie: 00:21:34

future as companies, as I don't know, businesses figure out that

Carrie: 00:21:40

we've been doing it really smartly and really efficiently

Carrie: 00:21:42

for a very long time and making money for ourselves and they

Carrie: 00:21:48

could actually do that. And I think that's what the pandemic

Carrie: 00:21:50

started to teach them, that this remote work thing, it actually

Carrie: 00:21:54

in a lot of situations, especially creative situations

Carrie: 00:21:57

like I can't be creative in an office, okay, it's not it's not

Carrie: 00:22:00

happening right? I need you all to go away.

Carrie: 00:22:04

So anyway, that is what I'm saying.

Bethany: 00:22:07

But I think that that's where what you call yourself in

Bethany: 00:22:11

the title, all that you hold is really important. And that's

Bethany: 00:22:14

what differentiates a producer versus a podcast manager. MM You

Bethany: 00:22:20

can manage your podcast that doesn't mean that you're a

Bethany: 00:22:22

producer, that doesn't mean that you do script writing, that

Bethany: 00:22:25

doesn't mean that you do dialogue content, that doesn't

Bethany: 00:22:28

mean that you are helping your client. And the creative process

Bethany: 00:22:32

of talking about which order their content should be going in.

Carrie: 00:22:36

Yeah, and I just want to like throw out one more, one

Carrie: 00:22:39

more title, and that is story editor, which is halfway between

Carrie: 00:22:44

in like regular podcast editor and producer, right? So you're

Carrie: 00:22:48

just helping edit the story in a way that makes sense and getting

Carrie: 00:22:53

to do that creative stuff.

Bethany: 00:22:54

And I think that because podcasting isn't

Bethany: 00:22:57

something that you can go to college and get a certification

Bethany: 00:23:00

or a degree, there is this opportunity to label yourself as

Bethany: 00:23:05

something that you're kind of not because you haven't had that

Bethany: 00:23:09

experience yet. So when I first started, I started as a podcast

Bethany: 00:23:13

manager and I did show notes for free that that was my first

Bethany: 00:23:17

client. That's how I got my first client. I didn't call

Bethany: 00:23:19

myself a producer. I started calling myself a producer when I

Bethany: 00:23:22

was walking my clients through the creative process of, What

Bethany: 00:23:27

are you talking about? What are you talking about? This? When I

Bethany: 00:23:30

started doing content editing and moving all of those

Bethany: 00:23:34

paragraphs around and doing the hokey pokey and making sure that

Bethany: 00:23:37

it all fit well, when I started inserting music and special

Bethany: 00:23:41

effects, that's when I transitioned myself into calling

Bethany: 00:23:45

myself a producer. But I don't think that the industry talks

Bethany: 00:23:48

enough about those titles and what all of that story editing,

Bethany: 00:23:53

all of that entailed.

Carrie: 00:23:55

Like there's language you use for the indie space,

Carrie: 00:23:58

right? And then there's language you use for all the other, like

Carrie: 00:24:02

the business to business and the network and the corporate and

Carrie: 00:24:06

the production houses. There's a different set of language. And I

Carrie: 00:24:09

think that that kind of I don't want to say like professional

Carrie: 00:24:14

because we are all professionals, corporate, corporate, you know,

Carrie: 00:24:19

I think like I think they're starting to get it.

Bethany: 00:24:22

And I think it also should be defined on your skill

Bethany: 00:24:25

set because there is a particular tool that everybody

Bethany: 00:24:30

raves about in regards to editing, and I'm not going to

Bethany: 00:24:34

name it, but it's not a duh and people adore it and they're like,

Bethany: 00:24:41

All you have to do is type in a remove filler words and all of

Bethany: 00:24:44

the filler words I removed. Are you listening to the audio?

Bethany: 00:24:47

Because it chops off the very next word. There are words that

Bethany: 00:24:53

don't even show.

Carrie: 00:24:54

Up.

Bethany: 00:24:54

On this platform. They're just I don't know where

Bethany: 00:24:57

they go. They going to. The strategy is.

Carrie: 00:24:59

Sometimes stuff just disappear. I can't.

Bryan: 00:25:01

Transcribe them. It's silence.

Bethany: 00:25:03

Yeah, it's just crickets.

Carrie: 00:25:04

And sometimes it, like, has gotten out of sync for me.

Carrie: 00:25:09

So, like, just makes things disappear, stuff it.

Bethany: 00:25:14

So I will periodically do content editing, like moving

Bethany: 00:25:19

words and paragraphs around in that tool.

Carrie: 00:25:22

That's the only thing I use it for.

Bethany: 00:25:24

And then I abort the mission. I click out of it and

Bethany: 00:25:27

that and I insert that audio into a it because I have more

Bethany: 00:25:31

control.

Carrie: 00:25:32

Mm hmm.

Bethany: 00:25:32

Yeah. Where I feel like I don't have control in that

Bethany: 00:25:35

tool. And I feel like a lot of people or it has become

Bethany: 00:25:40

commonplace now to say, I only work in this tool and I edit in

Bethany: 00:25:46

there and I get it and I do all of these great things, but the

Bethany: 00:25:50

sound quality remains something to be desired. Desired?

Carrie: 00:25:56

Yeah, yeah. And Sandra said it is not ready for prime

Carrie: 00:26:00

time and she's right. And I think it has specific use cases.

Carrie: 00:26:04

But again here they took an audio tool and zip video.

Bryan: 00:26:10

I would argue that they took a transcription tool and

Bryan: 00:26:12

tried to use it for audio and then pushed it to video.

Bethany: 00:26:15

I think that that is the downside of of I yeah,

Bethany: 00:26:18

because these tools are very easy to use versus mastering a

Bethany: 00:26:23

dog and because podcasting is becoming well is so popular and

Bethany: 00:26:29

people need assistance in it, it's something that you can

Bethany: 00:26:33

utilize quickly in charge well for it. So that's where I feel

Bethany: 00:26:38

like I is a little bit of a of a downfall and taking kind of the

Bethany: 00:26:42

easy way out for using some of these tools and mechanisms that

Bethany: 00:26:46

people are just bragging about. And that tool isn't cheap.

Carrie: 00:26:49

It's just as expensive as like Pro Tools or additions

Carrie: 00:26:54

or additions, right? It's actually I pay less for audition,

Carrie: 00:26:59

but I will say like, first of all, anybody who wants to like,

Carrie: 00:27:07

help build like if there's a developer out there wanting to

Carrie: 00:27:10

build the next competitor and wants to make a really good tool,

Carrie: 00:27:16

you know, come see us, right? We will give you because we

Carrie: 00:27:20

understand that this tool that like people may like, we will

Carrie: 00:27:25

still have customers. It'll be okay because nothing is going to

Carrie: 00:27:27

be that great, but it'll be if we can simplify our lives, make

Carrie: 00:27:32

our work faster, then I am all for it. If it can do

Carrie: 00:27:37

collaboration, all that stuff. So that's, that's what I want to

Carrie: 00:27:40

do. I just want it to assist me smartly, right? I don't need to

Carrie: 00:27:45

have every like I don't even know. They're like filler. Word

Carrie: 00:27:50

list is like a mile long. And I'm like, Nobody cares that much.

Carrie: 00:27:53

Like, okay,

Carrie: 00:27:56

so but that brings me to something Brian kind of

Carrie: 00:27:59

mentioned in places and that is chat chip.

Bryan: 00:28:05

T Yeah, so sorry, Steve, You're going to have to probably

Bryan: 00:28:09

I don't want to be responsible so whether you play the game,

Bryan: 00:28:12

that's up to you. But actually before I start talking about

Bryan: 00:28:15

A.I. and chat, I'm wondering for those of you that are watching,

Bryan: 00:28:19

like what are some of the trends that you're seeing also, because

Bryan: 00:28:23

those might be some things and the reason I and by extension

Bryan: 00:28:28

chat shows up for me is because I see two sides of this in the

Bryan: 00:28:34

I'll call it the news, right? There's the one side that says,

Bryan: 00:28:36

Hey, this is going to make everything so easy. And we've

Bryan: 00:28:39

already talked about how that's sort of true. It's sort of not.

Bryan: 00:28:43

And as a note, I have one client where there's very little that I

Bryan: 00:28:46

do for his show. It's just I'm involved in one part and one

Bryan: 00:28:49

part only. And one of the things I noticed is that this

Bryan: 00:28:54

particular client has started now taking a summary of the show

Bryan: 00:28:59

and just running it through chat to get his show notes and his

Bryan: 00:29:02

description and all that stuff. And there was one that I got

Bryan: 00:29:05

yesterday that it was I thinking, did you even read this like

Bryan: 00:29:10

sentence one and sentence three or the same sentence with

Bryan: 00:29:13

different words? And this absolutely does not capture the

Bryan: 00:29:17

tone of the episode. I think tools like captions and cast

Bryan: 00:29:22

magic, and some of those are trying really hard to capture

Bryan: 00:29:25

the tone of the show, to capture the tone of the episode. Whether

Bryan: 00:29:28

or not they nail it is maybe 5050, right? But they're trying

Bryan: 00:29:32

to do that. And I would say that there's the same kind of thing

Bryan: 00:29:35

going on. On the audio side, we talked about one tool where

Bryan: 00:29:38

there some editing stuff, but there are other tools trying to

Bryan: 00:29:41

essentially replace quality tools like Isotope Hour X or

Bryan: 00:29:48

ACON, Digital or cedar was at Cedar Wood or Cedar something or

Bryan: 00:29:52

other. These tools that are built to reduce reverb, fixed

Bryan: 00:29:56

background noise, all of those kinds of things. And what

Bryan: 00:29:58

they're doing is they're basically recreating it and

Bryan: 00:30:00

sometimes it works, and sometimes it's a train wreck.

Bryan: 00:30:04

It's just you don't know what you're going to get. And the

Bryan: 00:30:06

reality of these tools are that while they're probably free now,

Bryan: 00:30:10

some of them are they're probably not going to be free

Bryan: 00:30:12

forever because servers aren't free and bandwidth isn't free.

Bryan: 00:30:16

And unfortunately, free doesn't pay the bills. So like, I just

Bryan: 00:30:19

kind of throw that out there. But on the flip side, I'm

Bryan: 00:30:23

thinking about like the person who's going, is I going to take

Bryan: 00:30:26

my job and I'll go back to a Gary Vaynerchuk quote that I

Bryan: 00:30:30

heard in an interview a couple of days ago, maybe a week ago.

Bryan: 00:30:33

And it's a bit fear based, so I'm not super happy about it.

Bryan: 00:30:36

But this was the quote I'm not going to replace your job. A

Bryan: 00:30:39

human using A.I. is going to take your job. Now, that may or

Bryan: 00:30:45

may not be true, right? He likes to speak in absolutes. Probably

Bryan: 00:30:48

half of his predictions don't come true. Whatever. It doesn't

Bryan: 00:30:50

matter. But my thinking is how can I use A.I. tools to help

Bryan: 00:30:56

speed up my workflow? I think, Bethany, you talked about that.

Bryan: 00:30:59

So there are a few plug ins that I use that have an AI component,

Bryan: 00:31:03

one for IQ, one for compression, one for some other stuff. And so

Bryan: 00:31:07

I use those. I'm trying to get good with that.

Carrie: 00:31:09

I have to link those somewhere so I can look at them

Carrie: 00:31:12

later and maybe buy them.

Bryan: 00:31:14

Yeah, it's horrible. It's not inexpensive, but I like

Bryan: 00:31:18

their IQ. I like their compressor. Okay. And I like

Bryan: 00:31:20

their limiter. I don't use them on everything. Sometimes they're

Bryan: 00:31:24

not the right tool for the job. And that's the thing. If you

Bryan: 00:31:26

take your car to a mechanic's shop and he only has one wrench,

Bryan: 00:31:30

he's not fixing your car,

Bryan: 00:31:33

right. Unless you need a ten millimeter not replaced. If

Bryan: 00:31:38

that's the only thing he's got, he can't fix your job. So as

Bryan: 00:31:40

professionals, we need to have different tools. We need to know

Bryan: 00:31:43

what our tools can do. Well, sometimes it's an A.I. tool

Bryan: 00:31:46

that's maybe good at diagnostic in recommending something, which

Bryan: 00:31:49

is what I use the IQ for, because sometimes it can find

Bryan: 00:31:53

those resonances way faster than I could and fix them. Right? So

Bryan: 00:31:57

I would point that out. But then also just keep in mind you need

Bryan: 00:32:00

to be good with the tool. If you if you're watching this and you

Bryan: 00:32:03

read the description of the event, that was literally me

Bryan: 00:32:08

writing like five prompts in a row to chat, describing what

Bryan: 00:32:12

this episode was going to be about and then say, Give me a

Bryan: 00:32:14

description. Okay, well, can you make it better? Can you put it

Bryan: 00:32:17

in an ADR format, like doing all of that kind of stuff? And when

Bryan: 00:32:20

I got done, it was still a garbled mess.

Carrie: 00:32:22

Okay, I have to share something about that. Okay. And

Carrie: 00:32:27

this was like, just very quick. Your reactions to the posts you

Carrie: 00:32:35

made. Okay for this livestream. And I saw it was like five

Carrie: 00:32:41

paragraphs. It's like Random wrote this.

Carrie: 00:32:48

I was like, okay. And I skim to the bottom and I was like, Is

Carrie: 00:32:53

this the is this the livestream? And then I saw it was shipped

Carrie: 00:32:57

and I was like, Wow, that's terrible.

Carrie: 00:33:01

So I'm so sorry. I didn't I didn't actually read the

Carrie: 00:33:04

description to her to this.

Bryan: 00:33:06

That's okay. I didn't either. I got like halfway

Bryan: 00:33:09

through. I'm like, This is dumb. We might as well just make this

Bryan: 00:33:11

an object lesson.

Carrie: 00:33:13

Yeah, And that's why I rewrote or I wrote my own thing,

Carrie: 00:33:16

because usually I just copy Bryan What Bryan says.

Bethany: 00:33:19

The thing with it with chat shipped is I find my

Bethany: 00:33:25

clientele part of the package of of retaining us is we do their

Bethany: 00:33:30

copy, we write their podcast description, we write their show

Bethany: 00:33:33

notes. I can capture their voice because I have very different

Bethany: 00:33:37

clients. So I need to capture how they would share information

Bethany: 00:33:44

in a very different way for each client that I'm working on on

Bethany: 00:33:48

their podcast.

Carrie: 00:33:49

Chat.

Bethany: 00:33:49

She, I find, can't get the voice because it's a very

Bethany: 00:33:55

distinctive, individualized thing. And I absolutely agree

Bethany: 00:34:00

that AI is getting better faster, but I don't think that it will

Bethany: 00:34:05

get to the point where it is able to pick up the nuances of

Bethany: 00:34:09

that particular host and that is what the listeners gravitate to.

Bethany: 00:34:14

That is why the listeners are showing up. The copy is

Bethany: 00:34:18

attracting the listener, but the host and our hosts and or story

Bethany: 00:34:25

is what's keeping the listener engaged. So I guess it's great

Bethany: 00:34:29

to use a I in chat get or the other, you know, Happy Scribe or

Bethany: 00:34:34

Tammy or Cas magic or classic because there are so many in our

Bethany: 00:34:37

caps show to kind of give you a baseline, but you have to put in

Bethany: 00:34:43

the work and making it sound either like yourself or the

Bethany: 00:34:47

particular client that's paying you.

Bryan: 00:34:49

I would agree. And I think the other thing is to

Bryan: 00:34:52

build on what Jesse said I'm fine with I tools. I want to use

Bryan: 00:34:57

them to help with the process. But I mean, I spent an hour

Bryan: 00:35:02

yesterday rewriting a description that came from an AI

Bryan: 00:35:05

tool, right? I used the tool for what? It's good at transcribing

Bryan: 00:35:09

a lot of audio, summarizing it, and then giving me some ideas.

Bryan: 00:35:14

And then I said, Yeah, but no, no, not really. We're not going

Bryan: 00:35:18

to find a way to use the guest's name in every single paragraph.

Carrie: 00:35:22

Right? But it's doing that for SEO, right? And that

Carrie: 00:35:25

what it.

Bryan: 00:35:25

Might be, but I'm not going to do that because in the

Bryan: 00:35:28

end I want people to find it. People that are looking for

Bryan: 00:35:32

things because eventually the keyword stuffing gets caught,

Bryan: 00:35:35

Google tweaks the algorithm and unfortunately they have a lot

Bryan: 00:35:39

more engineers that make a lot more money. And a single AI tool

Bryan: 00:35:44

will never outsmart their ability to use their AI tools to

Bryan: 00:35:48

go, Yeah, no.

Carrie: 00:35:49

Yeah, no, it's wrong. It makes a good point. And also a

Carrie: 00:35:53

scary science fiction point. A.I. is learning from us,

Carrie: 00:35:57

testing every day too fast. I imagine that in one year

Carrie: 00:36:01

everything will be much more accurate, and I think she's

Carrie: 00:36:04

probably right. I think especially as more people adopt

Carrie: 00:36:09

the AI, the eye learns from more people and that growth becomes

Carrie: 00:36:13

exponential. And until there are robot overlords.

Bethany: 00:36:18

Can I just say something about that?

Carrie: 00:36:19

Yeah.

Bethany: 00:36:20

So I'm going to bring a little blackness into it because.

Bethany: 00:36:25

It is picking up from people who are blogging. It is picking up

Bethany: 00:36:30

from people who are writing content. The majority of the

Bethany: 00:36:33

people that are blogging and writing content are cis white

Bethany: 00:36:40

individuals. They're it's so it's really hard as a black

Bethany: 00:36:44

woman whose majority of clients are black women, to utilize a AI

Bethany: 00:36:52

and have it sound like AI sound or have it sound like my clients

Bethany: 00:36:57

because there isn't enough information out there for many

Bethany: 00:37:03

different reasons. Gatekeeping not allowing our voices to be

Bethany: 00:37:07

heard to extract how we would sound and utilize that in such a

Bethany: 00:37:14

way that's going benefit us. So I think that it's really

Bethany: 00:37:16

problematic if it's bringing things in from only one type of

Bethany: 00:37:22

demographic.

Carrie: 00:37:22

Well, you know, this point was made to Apple with

Carrie: 00:37:28

their facial recognition, and I didn't know that. Guess what?

Carrie: 00:37:34

They forgot to consider.

Bethany: 00:37:37

I'm a Detroiter all day, okay?

Carrie: 00:37:40

The people aren't all white. And so, like people with

Carrie: 00:37:45

darker skin, they couldn't unlock their phones with face

Carrie: 00:37:49

recognition because the camera didn't read them as people. And

Carrie: 00:37:53

you know, this oversight, which is probably the wrong freakin

Carrie: 00:37:58

word, but it's late, has existed in film forever and still exists

Carrie: 00:38:03

to this day. When I see watching movies and TVs and there's a

Carrie: 00:38:07

very dark person in in like the Shadow List where, you know, for

Carrie: 00:38:14

a white person, for a lighter skinned person, they're visible

Carrie: 00:38:17

at like clearly. And so that that is absolute technological

Carrie: 00:38:22

thing. And if anybody is interested, technically human is

Carrie: 00:38:28

a podcast that deals with ethics and technology. Yes. And it's

Carrie: 00:38:33

put out. I work for them. So full disclosure. But it's so

Carrie: 00:38:37

interesting.

Bethany: 00:38:38

And I think it's an important aspect that people who

Bethany: 00:38:41

aren't underrepresented, they don't have to be aware of it. It

Bethany: 00:38:45

doesn't have to be something that they think of regularly

Bethany: 00:38:48

because they're not impacted. Right. But I feel like people

Bethany: 00:38:53

who are underrepresented voices and that's why I love podcasting,

Bethany: 00:38:57

because I want to get so many underrepresented voices on this

Bethany: 00:39:01

platform. Because there Brian said earlier, there isn't a lot

Bethany: 00:39:04

of gatekeeping. We have an opportunity now to share our

Bethany: 00:39:08

experiences, to share our stories, and to share how we

Bethany: 00:39:12

walk through the world. And if a guy is moving at warp speed, but

Bethany: 00:39:19

they're not combining our stories or our experiences in

Bethany: 00:39:23

the information that they're pulling, they're taking our

Bethany: 00:39:26

options away. So that's another idea for A.I.. There's a lot of

Bethany: 00:39:31

others, but there's also those.

Carrie: 00:39:33

But I think there's a huge opportunity for us to

Carrie: 00:39:35

connect with the developers of these technologies because they

Carrie: 00:39:40

start out in the indie space too, and they rely on people like us

Carrie: 00:39:45

service providers to help them not only create a product that

Carrie: 00:39:52

we will love, but a product we will recommend to other people.

Carrie: 00:39:56

And through that, I mean, how many we've all seen it. I mean,

Carrie: 00:39:59

those of us who have been doing this for more than a few years

Carrie: 00:40:02

have all seen the companies that come in. They give us our dream

Carrie: 00:40:08

products and then change it to like consumer like, you know,

Carrie: 00:40:16

mass market product and take all those things that we love away.

Carrie: 00:40:21

And I just like somebody not to do that or people stop doing

Carrie: 00:40:25

that. But it happens all the time, right?

Bryan: 00:40:27

To that point, I think there is something else to be

Bryan: 00:40:29

aware of when you think about whether or not you want to use

Bryan: 00:40:31

A.I. and we've already touched on it, but to make it really

Bryan: 00:40:34

overt, A.I. tools don't create anything. They are not creative.

Bryan: 00:40:40

They are never smarter than the material they've been trained on.

Bryan: 00:40:43

So if they're trained on material that's created by a

Bryan: 00:40:46

particular segment of highly skilled people, they'll be very

Bryan: 00:40:50

good at that thing. If the training is by every single

Bryan: 00:40:54

person that uses the software and 95% of them don't know what

Bryan: 00:40:58

they're doing, it's only going to get better at doing the wrong

Bryan: 00:41:02

thing. More quickly. So when you choose your tools, be careful

Bryan: 00:41:05

about how they're trained, right? And then use them well and for

Bryan: 00:41:09

the benefit of the rest of us. Get better at your craft with

Bryan: 00:41:12

them so that we can all get better with you too and benefit

Bryan: 00:41:14

from you. But be aware it's not going to create something. It

Bryan: 00:41:19

might synthesize something, but it's only as smart as the stuff

Bryan: 00:41:23

that it's been trained on, and it will never create something

Bryan: 00:41:26

totally unique. Right? So if that's what you want, it's okay

Bryan: 00:41:31

to have an A.I. tool involved. But just remember, it's the

Bryan: 00:41:33

human that creative act within us as the editor or them as the

Bryan: 00:41:38

host or the writer that we have involved, or the graphic

Bryan: 00:41:40

designer or whatever. It's that choice. Full use of all of those

Bryan: 00:41:44

elements that creates the absolutely new thing that is

Bryan: 00:41:47

that voice that represents you.

Carrie: 00:41:49

I could like keep talking about this. I think this

Carrie: 00:41:52

is a fun topic. I think we need to do this again.

Bryan: 00:41:55

In about three years if we still have jobs.

Bethany: 00:41:57

Yeah. When we're all living together because we're

Bethany: 00:42:00

all homeless.

Carrie: 00:42:02

Actually, I think that would be a lot of fun.

Carrie: 00:42:06

Yeah, I think we need to do a part too. I think we need to get

Carrie: 00:42:10

like Daniel and Jennifer's voice in this. I would love to hear. I

Carrie: 00:42:15

mean, I love I love you, Bethany, but I'd love to hear from, like,

Carrie: 00:42:19

maybe some other people. No, I really I think this is like

Carrie: 00:42:23

there are a lot of really smart people that we know. We're very

Carrie: 00:42:27

fortunate. And I think it would be great to have on other, you

Carrie: 00:42:32

know, amazing, insightful people who really are. Because one of

Carrie: 00:42:37

the reasons I did have Bethany on, because her business is so

Carrie: 00:42:41

awesome, like, I love the way Bethany does business and I

Carrie: 00:42:45

house like I get to watch her grow and expand and test things

Carrie: 00:42:49

and try things. And so that and I ask her questions about

Carrie: 00:42:52

podcasting in like insight. And she always gives me such really

Carrie: 00:42:57

insightful answers. So I would like to bring on some more like

Carrie: 00:43:00

thought leaders like Bethany in our industry, because I think

Carrie: 00:43:03

that maybe some of us should start calling ourselves like,

Carrie: 00:43:06

you know, I think podcast editing. I think us is an

Carrie: 00:43:09

industry and it and I now stop here. I think we need to start

Carrie: 00:43:14

like taking agency over the narrative of podcasts, editing.

Carrie: 00:43:19

We shouldn't rely on the other trades. I know there are

Carrie: 00:43:23

newsletters and things, but I think we need to start coming

Carrie: 00:43:26

together a little bit more to have these conversations.

Bethany: 00:43:29

Carrie I would be really interested. I my one of

Bethany: 00:43:31

my friends, Akilah, she actually created an SEO tools. It's

Bethany: 00:43:36

called SEO Assist and you know, shameless plug for her just

Bethany: 00:43:39

because I love her. But I think it would be interesting to have

Bethany: 00:43:42

developers of tools on.

Carrie: 00:43:43

Yes, yes, yes.

Bethany: 00:43:48

Like, like people like her and like other people who

Bethany: 00:43:50

are creating these tools.

Carrie: 00:43:52

Yeah, we'll take that idea and run with it and then

Carrie: 00:43:54

we'll have some more thought leaders on. And I like to get

Carrie: 00:43:57

some really diverse group anyway and planning the show while

Carrie: 00:44:01

we're so. Yeah.

Bryan: 00:44:02

Thank you. Carrie is the new producer.

Carrie: 00:44:04

Yeah sorry. Next question. Do we want to do a

Carrie: 00:44:08

project question? Yeah.

Bryan: 00:44:09

Do we have time?

Carrie: 00:44:10

Yeah, we've got 6 minutes.

Bryan: 00:44:12

Bethany, I need you to pick a number from 1 to 5 four.

Bryan: 00:44:16

Oh, come on. That's a you picked an easy one.

Bethany: 00:44:19

It's a softball. Give me a softball. It's late.

Carrie: 00:44:21

Yeah.

Bryan: 00:44:22

This is the John Lee. Dubious question of the day,

Bryan: 00:44:24

apparently. What's the best piece of advice you've ever been

Bryan: 00:44:26

given?

Bethany: 00:44:28

It's so cliche, but trust your intuition and that

Bethany: 00:44:33

visceral feeling. It's. It's so cliche, but it's so true.

Bryan: 00:44:37

The best piece of advice I ever received was don't eat

Bryan: 00:44:40

the yellow snake.

Carrie: 00:44:41

I knew it.

Carrie: 00:44:44

It is good.

Bethany: 00:44:44

It could be lemon. It could be a lemon slushy. You

Bethany: 00:44:47

don't.

Bryan: 00:44:47

Know. You try it and let me know.

Carrie: 00:44:49

Is it worth finding out? So because this it actually this

Carrie: 00:44:52

kind of relates to my best piece of advice that I have ever

Carrie: 00:44:57

gotten. It's you get to decide. So you get to decide Yellowstone.

Carrie: 00:45:01

Are you willing to take the risk? I'm not. But you know, if you

Carrie: 00:45:05

are, that's cool.

Bryan: 00:45:07

I live in Tennessee. Hey, no, there's no way I'm touching

Bryan: 00:45:10

the hills now.

Bethany: 00:45:12

I want to go funny. Okay? The best advice that I saw

Bethany: 00:45:16

was I know that Ellen DeGeneres was canceled, but I love this

Bethany: 00:45:19

quote. And she was she said, be yourself unless you're a serial

Bethany: 00:45:22

killer. I think I have it on my Facebook as far as like the

Bethany: 00:45:26

quote.

Carrie: 00:45:26

All right. What do we do at this point?

Bryan: 00:45:29

I think we let people know what what they can do if

Bryan: 00:45:32

they want to be a guest on the show and join this bit of

Bryan: 00:45:35

craziness, which would be good to podcast editors. Mastermind

Bryan: 00:45:38

Dot com slash should be a guest that will redirect you to a

Bryan: 00:45:41

little form that you can fill out. And then we've actually got

Bryan: 00:45:44

it figured out to where we actually get notifications. If

Bryan: 00:45:47

you're interested in being on show or if you have a question

Bryan: 00:45:50

for us, if there's a topic you want us to cover. So like part

Bryan: 00:45:53

two of I and chat GPT or something like that, you can you

Bryan: 00:45:56

can do all of that there podcast editors mastermind dot com slash

Bryan: 00:45:59

be a guest at some point we probably need to give our names

Bryan: 00:46:02

and let people know who wasn't even going.

Carrie: 00:46:04

To introduce us.

Bryan: 00:46:06

Well I mean those that are joining us live now where

Bryan: 00:46:08

they can read so it's just horrible.

Carrie: 00:46:11

I'll just throw it in later.

Bryan: 00:46:12

Replay. We're sorry in advance.

Carrie: 00:46:14

Yeah. Yeah. Just intro us in in later. But I do want to

Carrie: 00:46:19

say just one one more thing. You should subscribe to our

Carrie: 00:46:23

newsletter to encourage me to purchase an upgraded

Carrie: 00:46:29

subscription because we're only a few away from hitting our cap.

Carrie: 00:46:33

But no, never going to do it unless I absolutely have to see

Carrie: 00:46:39

something like that.

Bryan: 00:46:41

Yeah. So if you've got extra email accounts, just make

Bryan: 00:46:44

Carrie push us over to something that's not the free service that

Bryan: 00:46:47

we've been using.

Carrie: 00:46:48

It's not free. It's not free. That's a horrible thing.

Carrie: 00:46:51

It's not free. We got to upgrade.

Bryan: 00:46:54

Yeah, we need to talk about that. We need to get on to

Bryan: 00:46:55

something free. Yeah, because there's no reason Carrie should

Bryan: 00:46:57

have to cover that cost. And then the rest of us think that

Bryan: 00:47:00

it's free.

Carrie: 00:47:00

Well. Oh, I don't really, Because I want to be able to do

Carrie: 00:47:03

the gifts and that.

Bryan: 00:47:06

All right, This is where therapy starts, and we end the

Bryan: 00:47:08

episode, right, Carrie?

Carrie: 00:47:10

Yes. It's been a long day. Thank you. Bethany Hawkins

Carrie: 00:47:13

of Crackers and Soup for joining us. You can find her at.

Bethany: 00:47:17

Crackers and Soup to Come.

Bryan: 00:47:19

I'm Brian Springer. I've been here all night so far. You

Bryan: 00:47:22

can find me at top Tier Radio.com and mostly on Facebook

Bryan: 00:47:25

because I'm old and all that stuff. Do you want me to do Who

Bryan: 00:47:29

wasn't here?

Carrie: 00:47:30

Yeah, I would love that.

Bryan: 00:47:31

Yeah. So unable to join us was Jennifer Longworth of

Bryan: 00:47:34

Bourbon Barrel podcasting at Bourbon Barrel podcasting dot

Bryan: 00:47:37

com and on all of the socials and Daniel Abendroth at Ross

Bryan: 00:47:41

Media Audio was also unable to join us tonight. And you can

Bryan: 00:47:45

find him on almost none of the socials. And above me on this

Bryan: 00:47:49

side is Harry Caulfield.

Carrie: 00:47:51

Eric you can find me at Kerry that land and also hiding

Carrie: 00:47:56

in my room just editing away. Oh my gosh do all the things

Carrie: 00:48:01

subscribe and stuff and we'll see you, you know, later. Thank

Carrie: 00:48:07

you so much for having me. You're welcome. Thank you,

Carrie: 00:48:10

Bethany. Bye. I think I reached my limit.

Carrie: 00:48:19

So how much is that?

Carrie: 00:48:28

So